The Economist posted an article last week that would raise the hackles on many a Congolese's neck. In the article, the paper ran over the familiar argument that Rwanda is trying to become a Singapore of Central Africa and that it is doing quite a bit better than most countries in the region in terms of good governance.
There is a good debate to be had about this, but will confine myself to a small nuance in the article: "Rwanda wants to be a regional trade hub, linking all the areas where Kinyarwanda is spoken (see map)."
Here is the map:
According to this, Kinyarwanda is spoken from Lake Edward to Lake Tanganyika and as far west as Province Orientale. Perhaps a cartographic error, but one that will touch a raw nerve among many Congolese. Kinyarwanda is indeed spoken through much of this area, but not due to a native population (that is confined to a smaller area): Hutu and Tutsi soldiers have been deployed throughout this region, much the the chagrin of locals, who often perceive them as foreigners and as abusive. Ugly xenophobia against Rwandans is widespread, but so are resentments left over from fifteen years of war during which many Kinyarwanda-speakers held positions of power in this area.
This map will - for the few Congolese who read the Economist - spark memories of a similar map presented by Rwandan President Pasteur Bizimungu to the diplomatic corps in Kigali in 1996, on the eve of the Rwandan invasion into the Congo. On the map, he had drawn a similar line into the Congo, claiming that this was all part of an area ruled by Rwandan kings in the pre-colonial era. While this was largely a fiction (kings received tribute from some of these areas, but did not rule over them), it helped justify Rwandan intervention.
In any case, one does not have to speak the same language in order to trade. Much of the economy of this polka-dotted area is indeed linked to Rwanda, but more because of the good roads and low taxes there, as well as the military networks of the ex-CNDP soldiers, than due to a common language.
Hi Jason,
ReplyDeleteLong time, hope you are new recovered... Kindly post the article of the Economist so people will have their own "point de vue". You are playing with people mind (intoxication and disinformation) here by posting only the map and writing your thinking about Rwanda and Tutsi (which is not new by the way).You should praise the Government of Rwanda of what is doing for his people and the region in terms of free trade, good governance etc...I know for you to survive you need this kind of job (specialist of Congo lol) Thank you.
Here you go: http://www.economist.com/node/21548263.
ReplyDeleteRwanda may take this opportunity of Congolese misunderstanding, to do anything which no one ever thought!
ReplyDeleteA piece of advice for Thisekedi and his supporters, if you think of giving Kabila a hard time, he may convince his fellows to separate the Swahililand (Katanga, Maniema and the two kivus) away from the rest part of the country then he became a president of Swahililand. That is the only thing Kagame is praying hard to happen and that is the only way Congo get peace.
I do not wish this to happen but if it happens that will be a big success for America's long time dream let alone Kagame.
Swahililand
I'm convinced Rwanda is something else then a country on a map, it's a concept that exists in the minds of foreign diplomats and policymakers.
ReplyDeleteJason, One recalls that following the 1998 Rwando-Ugandan invasion of Congo The Economist repeatedly took a tendentious pro-RCD line that demonstrated a clear institutional bias...one that Congolese voters have rejected at the ballot box. This map looks like a variation on an old theme.
ReplyDeleteIn the abstract, increased economic activity between the DRC and its East African neighbors is potentially beneficial for all the countries concerned. It is unfortunate that The Economist has chosen to introduce an obviously explosive and divisive cultural-linguistic element to a debate that should be considered on its economic merits. Any regional economic integration should be conducted on the basis of respect for national sovereignty and territorial integrity.
This map as it is drawn suggests a fictitious cultural hegemony that extends to Kampala...this no doubt will come as a bit of surprise to Yoweri Museveni and the people of Uganda.
Reallity is that Kagame has been able to implement his plan of economical expension in East DRC through CNDP.
ReplyDeleteNothing new in this. Desribing eastern DRC as kinyiarwanda speaking area is just fault but does not change the fact that Rwanda does have a grip on economy from Goma to Kalemi...
This is nothing new. This plan war drown in TANZANIA with the late president Nyerere and Ugandan Yoweri Museveni,both ethnic Tutsis. But for how long KAGAME and his tutsi dominated dictatorship will be able to rule Rwanda? as long as the Hutus makes up 85%of the Rwandan population ,for how long will this regime survive in such a divided country?sooner or later there is going to be a Rwandan spring ,Ugandan spring ...and all this tutsi plans will never materialise. Singapour is not a ruthless tribal dictatorship like KAGAME's Rwanda .Rwanda profited from the vacuum left by the 30 years of the MOBUTU dictatorship and KAGAME understand that the Congo was a sleeping Giant but not a dead tiger . Someone asked on this blog"how long can you play rodeo on a lions back?
ReplyDeleteIt is a fact that the Berlin Conference excluded from Rwanda/Burundi areas that were occupied by speakers of Kinyarwanda/Kirundi languages. Such areas included parts of what is now the (eastern) DRC. The Great Lakes Kinyarwanda/Kirundi service of the BBC probably has a potential listenership of about 30 million. The bulge on the map into the DRC may/may not be too big, I really cannot argue with you about that. The person who can organise the DRC is probably not yet born. In Rwanda it is already happening. In the eastern DRC people wanting stability, services, banking, flights etc will look east. This is part of the rationale of Rwanda as a services hub in the region and for example a place where you will be able to study for a Carnegie Mellon degree. It can also benefit those in the eastern DRC however much their self appointed spokespeople, many in the comfort of the Diaspora, do not want this.
ReplyDeleteMaybe i'm mistaken but is Rwanda not still dependent of international financial aid for par of his budget?
ReplyDeleteI don't think we should look at the situation without too much passions here. It's normal for people in the frontiers take advantage of better facilities from the neighbor. I believe there is a mafia in the Est but I don't think it's as ideological as people would make us to believe.
We should move on and find ways to break free from this circle of violence.
East of DRCongo can never become a part of Rwanda . You can be sure that Us, The Congolese will do our best, even to kill Kagame, Kabila, terrorism, to defend our earth. Wait and See the surprise, soon is soon
ReplyDeleteThere is little doubt that rwanda without pillaging resources from DRC wouldn't be at this stage of development. Surely Kagame is not going to be in power forever and hutus soon or late will come back.
ReplyDeleteWhich are the prerogatives of integration in the CEPGL area? No customs? No borders? No what? We (widely intended as the international community), like with this article too often recours to divide rather than unite. Rwanda can be a satellite of East DRC too rather than the opposite. A federal system not? Minerals are extracted in DRC than worked in Rwanda before exportation isn't good? For sure people in the East of DRC will look East, as people in the north of italy looked to austria and switzerland for better services rather than to rome. It is something policy-makers have to think about. Rwanda is also renovating the airport in Cianguvu in order to better serve Bukavu ...
I remember joking a long with somebody on field as the Republic of Great Lakes would be the only solution at the problem: a new country made up from North and SOuth Kivu, rwanda, burundi. It still sounds strange how in the globalisation era we tend to create more divisions rather than unity ...
Jason on the subject I have a personal question, is it possible to have your email address? Thanks
"Uganda is corrupt; Burundi a basket-case; Congo worse" Wow. Statements like this paint an incredibly inaccurate picture for the casual reader. If I didn't know anything about the region (as many don't) I would assume that Rwanda is a glowing jewel of lawfulness and progress amidst these crazy, wild African countries. Nothing mentioned about Rwanda being hugely complicit in the regions troubles. The article also praises Rwanda for being a bastion of lawfulness and then goes on to say that the elections are a sham. Hmmm... There is some reasonable reporting in the article, but it is offset by inaccuracies and contradictions.
ReplyDeleteWhat beter facilities are you talking about. How many hospitals ,universitys,factories,....are there in Rwanda?how many urban ereas or Cities apart from that small town (kigali)are there in Rwanda that can serve the entire great lake region. What does Rwanda make?if even biscuits consumed in Rwanda are made in Kenya .i can only describe Rwanda as à ticking bomb that sooner or later will end up exploding. Any sustainable developpement in central Africa wiil have to start from the 2geants(DRC,and Angola)and spread to the entire neighbourhood. as long as the DRC is not stable they will never be sustainable developpement in Central Africa .
ReplyDeleteAnand -
ReplyDeleteI second your point as well as what Andrea said.
It is a sad pity that rwanda still think they can get away with murder.
In my opinion, rwanda (its transnational tutsi elite and leaders) behave like an abused child who grew up to become himself an abuser.
Rich
The article offers no news. It's all recycled materials.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't get too excited about the definition of linguistic boundaries. I remember that when Swahili speakers define the Swahili-speaking region of Africa, they tend to include such "well-known" Swahili areas as Northern Mozambique, Southern Sudan, and Somalia. The point is: analysts of all stripes take liberties with defining linguistic boundaries, usually exaggerating the population of speakers of the given language. This is no different, and we need not see some nefarious or subliminal plans behind the map.
Well said Rich, I will second your opinion. To me, Rwanda is just a ticking time bomb as the 85% or more of the population that is presently being kept under wrap by a dictatorial regime, is bound to have its “Arab” spring. Further more this Rwanda business in the DRC is of a transitional nature as people in the DRC who resent Rwanda overbearing presence will surely find strategies to free themselves from this occupation.
ReplyDeleteAs a matter of fact, people in the DRC know that the mess in the North East of the DRC is created, maintained, fueled by Rwanda and its allies(both Hutus and Tutsis) in the North East of the DRC together with JK’s delinquent, incompetent and simply unconscious government.
Bismark
Only people who do not know history can marvel at Rwanda today, I do not beleive that current Rwanda can be compared to the glows of Zaire in 1970's. Kagame's model is not sustainable, his strategy of leveraging on the guilty of the International Community will soon need replacement. The spotlights will soon turn on Kagame and his chronies. And once Zairians will get rid of Rwanda's trojan horse, Kabila, the International community will have to rethink its policy for the so called great lake region. Just imagine a presence of one millions Zairian soldiers in the Kivus, this is enough to control both FDLR and APR. Just think about it!!!
ReplyDeleteI have updated the post with a link to an article written by David Newbury in 1997 that discusses the famous Bizimungu map (which originated from Rwandan historian Alexis Kagame). (https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B3GJKd5i8Pncem5UMkI5NFVTbE9VeWlXZEM3bUViQQ)
ReplyDeleteThe RPF leaders(The ruling party) current and future plan has a very sophisticated network which will work with the presence of Kagame or not.
ReplyDeleteOnly Kagame's hand is on the trigger of the ruling party decision. If Kagame dies or disappear, another Kagame will follow his path. Kagame was not the only Tutsi who has started to fight against the Hutu extremist, they are many of them under and over the ground.
They are a lot of reasons why one should think the Eastern part of the country is being colonized by the central Government. If you take the town of Goma, the current road construction scandal can be an elementary example, the good road has been dismantled to be repaired for the so called campaign, not even 1/3 of the road got finalized for the reason of lack of fund; dust, small ditches every where. The Local parliament complained concerning the issue against the Governor but they end up being suspended - who cares.
Rwanda is a small country but it was/is capable of to destabilizing a huge country like DRC (It is like a mosquito weaken a huge body).
I am neither Tutsi nor Rwandan origin but i like any one who is patriotic and do any thing possible to keep the interest of his people - Just Like America go every where to protect their citizen before it reaches to their soil.
DRC is becoming every body's land (But not no man's land). Uganda took some part, Angola followed, now Rwanda may continue...
Tika
I quote Rich "In my opinion, rwanda (its transnational tutsi elite and leaders) behave like an abused child who grew up to become himself an abuser. " as this is in my view a good resumè of the situation.
ReplyDeleteTika I agree that the business of minerals operated by rwanda in DRC is a complex network but I see kagame as the only that knows more or less how to handle it. Whoever else apart from him can control also the Nkunda case, the ties with Ntaganda, the military operations in East of Drc? He already had to get rid of 4 generals a few weeks ago because they probably went too far, he is polarizing tensions also within the tutsi elite because of jalousies. What about Victoire Ingabire? Do you think that the international community will tolerate again in front of somebody that is not kagame? Who else actually can take over the country and have the authority to treat these dossiers without troubles? Kabarebe? The MoFA? Who else apart form kagame has the aura in the international community that allow him to go as far as killing opponents all-over-the-world? I think the international community is aware of that and I read (maybe it was on this blog, not sure) that both Susan Rice and Tony Blair already whispered at Kagame's ears that he has to prepare a democratic transition during his last, and most difficult, mandate. I hope this can happen before the Rwandan Spring that in my opinion is only likely to resurge old tensions in the whole region.
Let's wait and see what will happen now that UNHCR for example agreed on the cessation clause for rwandan refugee and 100.000 rwandans are expected to come back to the country soon. I expect tensions on land issues but also on a more general political landscape...
andrea
Jason –
ReplyDeleteThanks for the link to the David Newbury article. I guess the problem here is that often times people (like the author of “Africa’s Singapore?”), classify complex concepts in a rather simplistic way so that they can fit with the agenda and practices of their political mentors or idols.
To me, the economist’s map is just another confused attempt to promote a certain idea that some ethnic groups are somehow superior to others as claimed by people like Alexis Kagame when he said, people of Hamitic origins from the north introduced breeding livestock, iron work, kingship, social hierarchy by castes and many other new cultures in north eastern part of DRC or the great lakes region… which is simply not true.
Despite the lack of seriousness of these classifications, they have enjoyed posterity and are taken up as such and given some kind of seal of validity in ‘intellectuals’ circles. I’m surprised that some people can bank on this kind of disconnected classifications or mapping to promote their ideas…
Ethnicity and the language supplement attached to it are sensitive points on which our miseries are formed and give us a weird feeling of getting bogged down whenever we feel able to wield evidences and primary data about them.
The map in the Economist and the analysis it comes are the perpetuation of works by people like, Lacger, A. Kagame and Maquet. They are simply another way of trying to show that Rwandans (Kinyarwanda speaking people) are taking their destiny into their own hands and that they have a sound ‘scientific’ and moral basis upon which to justify whatever they do; right or wrong. The fact is the maps and ‘scientific’ justifications they offer, will always have their Congolese equivalents in terms of re-writing works by, Moeller, Verhulpen, Boone, de Saint Moulin etc…
To finish, these maps and the ideas they are conveying are not ‘science’, which can stand outside politics and context; they are instead fatally flawed by their colonial origins and their political motivations. People should seek peace and work hard to make it happen rather than banking on the domination of one ethnic group or speaking a given language over another. Yes Kinyarwanda can mean something in the region but I doubt this will be more important than French, English or Swahili in that part of the world.
Just a thought…
Rich
Much of the wishfull thinking on here has dated from the late 1990s. How many then were predicting and hoping for the demise of the RPF govt in Kigali? Ignored by most posters, no doubt since probably few of them have ever been there, are the developments the Kigali govt has made to benefit the poorest e.g. in areas of education, health care, communications not to mention stability and peace. Will ordinary Rwandans give these things up? Would not posters in the US welcome an affordable health insurance system as promised by Obama but not delivered (and now introduced in Rwanda)?
ReplyDeleteSOMALI and DJIBOUTI are the only African countries with Majority TUTSI populations. in Rwanda or Burundi the Tutsis make up less than 20% of the population,and in the DRC the Kinyarwanda speaking mostly Tutsis ,makes up less than 1% of the population.if you want to lecture people about the Tutsis and their sophistication and achievement...then SOMALI and DJIBOUTI shall be used as the Model of that sophistication and Tutsis achievement but not Rwanda,Burundi,or The DRC.
ReplyDeleteThe only solution for central Africa,is for the 5 SWAHILI speking Eastern Congo provinces(KATANGA,2 KIVUS,MANIEMA,PROVINCE ORIENTAL)to join together and break away from Kishasa. the SWAHILILAND shall break away from the D.R.C and join the EAST AFRICAN COMMUNITY and the SADEC like south Soudan just did.
ReplyDeleteThe economy of Katanga is booming and Katanga is attracting more investors than Rwanda. the DRC is not just north kivu and south Kivu. this long arm has reached its limits and very soon its going to be chopped of.MONUSCO is the only reason why Rwanda still have any influence in North Kivu.the so called UN PEACEKEPERS(MONUSCO) are just a western Criminal Mafia that has been using Rwanda to lute and occupy the KIVU. there is only trouble now in regions under MONUSCO's control.if the congoles or the FARDC are a bunch of criminal repists...they shal be mass rape going on in KINSHASA,LUBUMBASHI,MATADI,KANANGA...but not only in regions that borders Rwanda and regions that are under the Control of the so called UN PEACE KEAPERS(MONUSCO).now the UN occupation forces are using Rape as the reason to stay and continue to occupy and lute the DRC.
ReplyDeleteThe consequence of Eritrea to separate from Ethiopia 20 years ago can be taken as a lesson for most of Congolese.
ReplyDeleteLet me remind you... At the time of Mengistu Hailemariam (The former leader of Ethiopia)regime, there were two army rebels groups for a single objective, fighting against him (one to liberate Eritrea then another one to liberate the whole Ethiopia, They were making a joint attack to throw Mengistu - after many years they all succeeded they dream. After years Eritrean must decide in referendum to separate or not, most of them chosen to be separated from Ethiopia. Ethiopian got upset and sent all Eritrean back to Eritrean, at the time of deportation no one was allowed to take anything than clothes. As it was one country before, most Eritreans had buildings, cars and other properties which they had in many part of Ethiopia was left behind, even those who were married to Ethiopian citizens were forced to leave their children and wives behind.
I have three questions?
1. What do Congo learn from this - if the worst happen?
2. If the Swahililand get separated from the rest part of Congo who will be the looser?
3. Which part of Citizen has invested in other part of province?
Cobra2
The Economist is tendentious as usual. What is the meaning of "where Kinyarwanda is spoken"? Does it imply a 'native' language or a 'majority' language? In any case, they have it outrageously wrong on Uganda. Since when did Bakiga, Bakonjo and Banyankole all speak Kinyarwanda?
ReplyDelete"Singapore"? Since when did Rwanda begin to industrialize, either through import substitution, or via export-oriented sectors? Less corruption than elsewhere in the region is good but a long way from being a "a Singapore of Central Africa".
How can you compare the Swahili speaking eastern Congo to Eritrea, Eritrea was a small region of Ethiopia with limited resources and depended heavily on ADIS ABABA, the SWAHILILAND is the bigest ,richest and most populated Region of the DRC,and if it can break away it will be the 3rd or 2nd bigest country in Africa and with its minerals and oil wealth and touristique potential ,it can be the richest country in Africa.KINSHASA is the only thing that has kept this region from developpement .after more than 3decades of the catastrophic dictatorship of MOBUTU, a decade of foreign invasions,and the now failed 15 years of both KABILA father and son to try and force Kinshasa on the East ,it is time for the people of Eastern Congo to choose their own destiny.
ReplyDelete@ anonym MARCH 3, 2012 4:25 PM,
ReplyDeleteDo you have any data implying that Katanga will want to be part of this new order? How well the so called swahililand economies are integrated? That's one basis for success. Did you considered that all those provinces are land locked? How do you offer to make them the 2 or 3 bug economy of the continent without trading with the evil west side?
You know that there is diamond and oil in Bas congo, a sizable reserve of oil in the cuvette centrale (bandundu), gold in the Equateur and infinite/inhabited lands in the same province,etc?
If we push your logic a little bit further as the Est has most of the mines and population, it should be severed from the West. Not for the reasons you advance but because any economist will tell you that the less people you have to worry about the more wealth you can redistribute. So who will lose in this aftermath? I doubt Katanga will want to pay for the Kivus. Even people from Butembo were glossing about how their business was booming when the RCD had Goma and beni was with Nyamussi and the government.
Bottom line, think about what you say and assess the situation, know who are your enemies and deal with it. You have a bigger problem than just kinshasa, it's your land. try to organize your people instead of blaming others for wealth that will always benefits the few, whatever configuration this country will be unless we, as one, can change things.
They said we are a geological scandal, they said we are rich, they said we have potentiel, think about it, are you rich? do you feel richer everyday? Do you see the money? Was kinshasa build by your money? If you think hard about it, you will see that we all are the 99 % of the poor congolese and the few, 1% will push for secession not for your benefit but for their own good, in order to make more. Don't be fool by that fantasy of us being rich. WE ARE BROKE! WE HAVE TO WORK HARD TO GET RICH. WE HAVE TO BAND TOGETHER, GET ORGANIZE IN OTHER TO RECLAIM OUR INHERITANCE.
Like in the bible story of the talent, we have the wealth but chose to hide it. We have to make it work for us not the way around.
FYi: Kabila and the real center of power have been to the Est. What are we talking about here? It doesn't matter where the person come from, what matter is how the person will turn out to be a good steward. Question: why did in the world the Eastern city of Goma voted for this westerner name Khonde vila kikanda? Why did people were calling out for this mbusa mabe guy from the West? keep it real brother.
@ Anonymous,March 3, 2012 4:25 PM
ReplyDeleteYou say…"and the now failed 15 years of both KABILA father and son to try and force Kinshasa on the East "...Aren't both Kabilas Swahiliphone from the East, “Swahili Land”. In your own words these Swahili guys have failed for 15 years to force Kinshasa on the East. What does this mean??? I suppose you mean that they failed as rulers. I thought that Kinshasa and the provinces in the East were part one Nation called DR Congo. What is there to force on anything or anybody? Kinshasa and the provinces in the East are one entity; it is like saying that you are forcing your own head to stay attached to your own body!!!
You say, "KINSHASA is the only thing that has kept this region from development"...but you then mention a “…decade of foreign invasions…” as one of the reasons for the lack of the development in the East. Since Kinshasa in your words is “the only thing that has kept this region from development”, I can come to the conclusion that Kinshasa as the sole culprit for the misery in the East is also responsible for the wars in the East. By the way, who has been ruling Kinshasa for the past 15 years? The answer is a couple of Swahili guys from the East. You are in fact blaming the Swahili guys in power for the past 15 years for preventing the development of the Swahili East. Stop being funny, you must be a "provocateur" and must be in the business of “distractions”, the DRC is one and will stay one; it is our heritage and will be the heritage of our kids and their kids. Your "Swahililand" is just a product of your warped imagination in "Lalaland".
...."it is time for the people of Eastern Congo to choose their own destiny"…
You want to explain how they will do that as they are under occupation from our neighbors to the East.
Bismark
The Swahili speaking Eastern Congo has always been Economically connected to the East African Community than to Kinshasa,all those Eastern Provinces are land locked but All world wide Import and Export activities from the Swahili speaking East ,are processed via the port of MOMBASA(kenya) and DAR ES ALAM(Tanzania) but not MATADI. Bukavu is closer and is linked by road to MOMBASA and DAR ES ALAM than Matadi,to bukavu the Port of Matadi is non existent.all Eastern Provinces are almost equally rich in resources and the KIVU will never need Katanga to pay for anything.the Kivu and KATANGA can be compared to CALIFORNIA and TEXAS both are self sufficient provinces and do to its fertile land,the KIVU can became a bread basket for Katanga and the entire region.if Bas congo,Equateur,Bandundu... has all that gold,diamond,oil...then there is no reason for Katanga,Kivus,Province Oriental and Maniema...to continue sending all their Gold ,coltan,cuivre,cassiterite,diamon...revenues to KINSHASA and get nothing in return. I am not a fun of Kabila but if MOBUTU and his criminal irresponsible drug addicted gangs just did 20% of what was supposed to be their job, then KABILA and his EASTERN GANGS would have not inherit a ruined and bankrupt Country with no raods,no Army ,no police,no hospitals ...for the entire history of the DRC, the east has never received nothing from the West.and the west has always been dependent on the EAST for almost everything.the only thing that the west has ever exported to the East is MUSIC and arrogance.
ReplyDeleteMost Katangais wants nothing more to do with KINSHASA and Kabila is the only reason why Katangais are still tolerating being part of the D.R.C. and i dont see any Katangais Who will reject the idea of a SWAHILILAND with LUBUMBASHI as its capital city.
ReplyDeleteLet's entertain this idea for a minute.I'm a little confuse here my dear brother. You are talking about building a new country but in the same time you are boasting about your dependence to others( East Africans country). When I said land locked, I meant that you will always be dependent to the goodwill of your neighbors(like south Sudan and his petrol). Unless of course you want to be a vassal state of Kenya or Tanzania,or even Rwanda, that's your personal choice.
ReplyDeleteI gather you have a visceral hatred towards your brothers and sisters from Kinshasa. In reality, beside the bateke I think, nobody is from Kinshasa. People ca,me from all across the country to settle in Kinshasa.
For your wealth,I can assure you, without any doubts, that your money were (and still are )well spend by a minority in power, not the whole Kinshasa. The fat cats as John le Carre called them. Mobutu abused of his power but it wasn't alone. And beside, in contrast with the Kabilas, he didn't limit his "generosity" to people from his clan. He went across the board, making the like of Barthélémy Bisengimana, andre kalinda, Nendaka bika,etc
All provinces send money to the government which incidentally had his quarters in Kinshasa. Nobody got their money back. Why do you think JK obtained the power to sack governors? Because of the 40 % retrocession. Nobody asked for your money, they want their 40 % back.
Your hatred seems misplace, it's suspect in my eyes that you are not condemning Rwanda and Uganda for plundering the East. Are you a front runner for this mythical empire from Rwanda?
@ anonym MARCH 5, 2012 9:57 PM,
ReplyDeleteyou are entertainning my friend, who are most katangais? You conducted a scientific survey or did you surveyed your friends?
Most congolese "tolerate" Kabila because he is weak.
@Swahililand
ReplyDeleteRead this, maybe you will learn something:
http://www.cd.undp.org/mediafile/Profil_NK.pdf
Our ancestors shared the same history, starting from the time of the king Leopold II. We suffered together during the time of Mobutu and during the invasion of our country by the so called banyarwanda. And in the history of our country, only outsiders such the belgians and the so called rwandophones perpetrated massive human right abuse on a large scale. We never kill each other as the others have done for many decades.(here i speak about Rwanda and Burundi). In concluding we can talk vs each other but not to point of hating and killing each other and we know how to forbear each other.And now we know that the so called war in the East is imposed on us for the sake of our minerals, with Rwanda at the forefront of it. And we know also that the idea of a so called swahili land is only in the mind of Kagame and his advisors (Blair and Rice). Have you ever imagined what the katangais think of being subjected to the Rwandais? I assure you, it is the same feeling shared among all congolese, starting from Beni down to Boma. We are conscious that Rwanda without war in Congo will become a no country.
ReplyDelete@ swahililand
ReplyDeletecheck this out
http://www.congomines.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/BanqueMondiale-2008-GrowthWithGovernance.pdf
It's contain some figures province by province
Wow, this discussion is quite ridiculous. But from all the comments this is probably the best one "SOMALI and DJIBOUTI are the only African countries with Majority TUTSI populations".
ReplyDeleteSeeing that most commentators are Congolese with internet access and some degree of fluency in English, you prove once again why you are not able to organise a state properly...
I know, really mean and prejudice, but who I am sure some secretly agree...
lmao. Indeed, that was ridiculous.
ReplyDeleteRE update
ReplyDelete"Under colonial rule, therefore, the Nyiginya dynasty lost sovereignty but gained power-both in terms of territorial expanse and in terms of administrative capacity."
Maybe for reasons of political correctness, the author doesn't dig deep here. Still, one has to remember that it were the Belgians who crushed the independent Hutu kingdoms - the most prominent being Bushiru - before handing them over to the Nyiginya dynasty. "Rwanda" as we know it is an "artificial" entity much like Uganda, Kenya, or DRC.
@ ASunnyDayInGoma - it was not the Congolese, but the 'enlightened' Europeans who started this story, and it has lived on because it is intuitive. Modern genetic research has disproved this theory completely. Both are Bantus 100%. But, the Tutsis are a different kind of Bantus than the Hutus, lacking the usual markers associated with the mainstream south-eastwards Bantu migration. The Tutsis however share some markers with a number ethnicities in the CAR and (don't shoot me) CAR pigmeys. The genetic research has also confirmed extensive marriage of Hutu women by the Tutsis - but not vice versa.
Wonder if anyone will ever commission a broad genetic study into the origins of various Central African populations. Much still to be investigated here.
Hope such a study will not result in another war.
Just noticed that the html file is called "rwandas-lebensraum". Remembering that many (not only the RPF propaganda) like to draw parallels between Le Genocide and the Holocaust, it can't get more provocative than that!
ReplyDeleteBut I really like this title.